Building a brand that’s good for your gut by trusting your gut

Yogurt without animal milk isn’t anything new, but when a new kid emerges in your city who creates an amazing plant-based yogurt, you jump to support it! This interview with Jade Herrmann at Yoggu!, who calls herself the “Mother of yogurts,” took place in the fall of 2021, but we all love a good founder story, and it’s been great to see how the brand has evolved since.

Justin Manning: Alright, welcome to another episode of VEG Networking Canada. We’re going to start with our land acknowledgement. We wish to acknowledge, honour, and respect that much of the land we are gathered on is on traditional unceded territories of many different indigenous peoples of Canada. We have a very special guest with us today. She is the creator of a super probiotic coconut alt yogurt. A proud supporter of the dairy-free and women of colour business movements, a Simon Fraser and UBC alum, and you can find out more right away with the hashtag #doyourgutsomegood. We have the founder and CEO of Yoggu! Jade Herrmann.

Jade Herrmann: Thank you.

JM: So our first question for you is, I believe it’s around 2017:

Why don’t you tell us more about your vegan origin story?

JH: So I had become vegetarian when I was in grade 9, so I think I was about 14 at the time. One of my girlfriends had brought in a book. Oddly enough, the book was called Skinny Bitch and I actually despised the name of the book but I understand why it was so powerful at changing people’s thoughts on animal welfare. I think when you play on people’s weight issues, you can end up attracting a lot more people than you would have maybe than with a vegan title or something of that sort.

Anyways, I read the book, and it had nothing to do with weight loss. I knew that was the case. It had everything to do with animal welfare and it gave a lot of examples of hog farms and chicken farms and it was really mind-blowing for me.

So at the age of 14, I literally remember coming home and saying to my mum, “I’m going vegetarian” and at the time I think Daiya had just launched tofu with something in it, but veganism and vegetarianism was just sort of starting and I remember my mum being a bit concerned because she wasn’t too sure what she would make me and I assured here I would be making my meals myself. So this was a huge amount of responsibility for me to take on, but honestly, it was this first dive into food and nourishing my body and being this conscious consumer that I really feel like I am today.

I have a lot of respect for the foods that I eat and I feel like so much of that has come from this journey of being a vegan and going on this plant-based lifestyle. So fast forward, I think about 8 years or so, I then made the transition to veganism. That was after spending a year living in France, eating really decadent cheese, yogurt, ice cream, gelato, and I came back, and I just felt like something needed to change in my life. I was going through a transitional phase and I decided to go plant-based.

Then I ended up getting a job working for Vega, which is a plant-based protein company here in Vancouver. It was great because they had a plant-based chef who made us lunch every day. I feel like that gave me so much inspiration for cooking meals at home. It was really easy to just transition to this lifestyle. I’ve always just carried it on, and it has become something that I am extremely passionate about. My business is also a vegan business, and that is also very much part of my life now, so it makes sense how I got to where I am right now. It has been a journey over the past 10+ years.

JM: That’s amazing. At least you made it easy on your mum when you said I’m going to cook my own stuff. That’s so amazing. The power of community around you and the people that you’re around to spur that on, amazing. So you started to talk a bit about your business and that’s the second question:

What’s your entrepreneurial origin story and is it Yoggu!, or was it something before that?

JH: I definitely had a few. Well, I had one business before, but it was a fun side hustle. It was actually while I was working at Vega. I had a vintage company that I was running on the side but Yoggu! Is very much the first time I made one of my ideas a reality.

Growing up, I always wanted to open a vegan or vegetarian cafe, but it was this time in my life where I had to go to university, I was finishing up my studies, and it never was the right time. Truly, it was that time that I spent living in Paris that shifted the trajectory of my life. I love food, so obviously living in Paris was this amazing gastronomic experience, and like I mentioned, I was eating decadent, creamy think yogurt. I think the French have really mastered that art and craft, along with cheese and wine and all the rest.

When I moved back to Vancouver and I went plant-based, I was really struggling with the dairy-free alternatives and finding that sort of option. I feel like I had it really good living in France, eating that creamy, thick yogurt, so I just gave up yogurt altogether.

I still pursued the vegan lifestyle and ultimately was not satisfied with what was on the market. I had always known about making coconut yogurt yourself, but it always seemed a little daunting to me. It was actually when I left Vega that I had a lot more free time on my hands, and I thought, “I have all this time I’m going to start making coconut yogurt.” I think I went and got a can of coconut milk, some probiotic pills, and I tried my hand at it. And it failed pretty miserably. I remember the first few batches going rancid and I was like, “I don’t know, it seems pretty simple but I’ve managed to screw this up.” That was the catalyst for this obsession of mine.

I really wanted to master a coconut yogurt of my dreams, which meant thick, creamy, decadent yogurt without the milk. I knew that there had to be a way to achieve this, and I remember doing a lot of Googling, a lot of YouTubing, and I found that people were making coconut yogurt from young Thai coconuts.

So I would go to the Asian supermarket, buy my own young coconuts, open them at home with a big cleaver and scoop out the meat, use the raw coconut water and inoculate it with probiotics. That was the first time I had this lightbulb go off where I was like, “I feel like I’m really onto something—this is thick, creamy, it’s got the taste and texture,” and so that’s what I went off of. That was actually the product I launched first to market here in Vancouver back in 2018, I believe.

We ended up getting into Whole Foods, and we were in the farmers markets with that recipe. I remember I sold a 500ml jar for $20.99. It was pretty bananas. But the quality of ingredients really warranted that price because there was so much labour that went into making one jar of yogurt, let alone the cost of the ingredients. It was a very premium product.

There was a moment where I had to sit with myself and figure out what my mission with Yoggu! was, like what I was trying to achieve. About a year after I launched, I knew I wanted to make the product more accessible to people. This has always been something that, for me as a vegan, I want more people to transition to this sort of lifestyle and to never feel like they have to give something up. So I knew that I could be a part of that, but I also knew that a $20 price tag wasn’t the way I was going to get there.

So I flipped the whole recipe on its head again and worked with a food scientist, and we came up with what the Yoggu! recipe is now. I spent many months trying to source a really great Fair Trade organic coconut cream. I feel like I am quite a stickler when it comes to coconut products. I never liked the really artificial coconut products. Finding a cream did take a while because of all the samples I was getting, they had this overly coconut-y taste but we finally settled on the supplier we currently use and were able to slash the price tag more than half.

Our products now retail for $8.99, which is comparable to other brands that are on shelves. That was a huge win. The feedback from our customers was just amazing. It truly was more in alignment with what people were searching for. Some of my favourite comments are when someone is not even vegan, and they love the product, “Wow I had no idea it was vegan.” That is always such a win because it brings everything back to why I decided to pivot and make this product more widely available for people. Slowly but surely, we are well on our way to doing that.

JM: Well, absolutely. It is not a replacement, it’s not as good as you could have, it’s better. You mentioned you can’t do it alone, bringing people in and having a team is how you’re going to go further, so that’s amazing.

What are some trends in your industry?

JH: Yeah, I mean I feel like the dairy-free. Do you want to talk more about like the dairy-free industry? Or do you want to talk more specific to yogurt?

JM: Yeah, specific to what you’re amazing at, maybe. What are some trends you think, dairy-free too?

JH: Yeah, for sure. I’ve definitely seen a lot of brands, like I saw Chobani recently. They came out with like a full-fat, Greek-style yogurt. I think that, you know, more and more people are sort of over the watery options. But that being said, I think that something I’m really proud of at Yoggu! is that we do truly ferment all of our yogurts. And that’s been a huge eye-opener for me along this sort of journey.

Another thing to mention is that another mission we have at Yoggu! is to really just change the foodscape. And what I mean by that is, whether it’s the transparency of our ingredients and what we actually share with our customers, for example, we truly ferment our yogurt. So we’re not just adding some probiotics and citric acid and saying it’s yogurt. We’re actually letting that flavor build through fermentation. And I think that is so unique to Yoggu!, not only for the great probiotic benefits, but really that’s how we achieve that taste. And all of our product is craft fermented. When I say “craft fermented,” it’s done in small batches. It’s not done the way that a lot of companies are doing it.

And I think it’s really a missed opportunity, because people are demanding better products that taste good. I think that’s so much in the vegan categories, especially dairy-free and dairy-free yogurt, no one’s really been addressing the flavour. I think that so many people are hitting so many of the sort of markers like “Oh, it needs to be keto” or “gluten-free” or whatever else. But they’re not hitting something that is just so important, which for me is flavour. You know, if you’re going to try and convert anyone, or help anybody try to sort of convert over to veganism…and we meet people where they’re at, like we’re not about, “Hey, you need to be vegan if you’re consuming Yoggu!”

But I just think flavor needs to be the top priority and so, going back to your question about trends, I’m seeing a lot more companies addressing texture and addressing the probiotics and the health components, but I think flavor is something that just needs to be really executed more and more.

JM: Boom! Everybody, you heard it here first because Yoggu! is a trendsetter in terms of taste, and it sounds like ahead of the curve with craft fermentation. That’s really, really cool. You’re like a scientist, I guess? Part-time scientist, full-time scientist?

JH: Yeah, or I surround myself with really great scientists.

JM: Yeah, exactly, that’s probably more like it, and better.

So where is Yoggu! going in the future?

JM: Like, across Canada? Are you already there yet? What’s up?

JH: We actually launched in Toronto this summer, in July, which was huge. I would say Toronto and Alberta we’ve had the most demand outside of BC. And we just felt like, you know, there’s never going to be a perfect time, we just need to do it. The ducks sort of aligned and we launched in July. It’s been really incredible. We’ve always been big on just organic growth, because we are a startup and we don’t have a bunch of spend in that area yet.

But just from people’s emails and Instagram posts and stories…really seeing how this product has changed their lives. I mean, people either say it’s a game changer, or it’s life-changing. And I don’t take that lightly. If it changes your life, or you say it does, that’s pretty huge for me, to know that before Yoggu! there wasn’t an option that checked all the boxes.

So just really cool to see more people have access to our product. We’re going to be launching in Alberta very, very soon. We have a lot of really excited Albertans who are ready for our product. And then yeah, we’ll just be continuing to expand across Canada and then hopefully into the US very soon. We already have some retailers that are really excited about our product, so it’s really just, once again, getting those ducks in a row to make that all happen.

JM: Absolutely. Well, you’re definitely on your way, so US watch out!

What are some charitable organizations that Yoggu! supports, or is that something you see coming down the pipe?

JH: You know, it was interesting, I was thinking about this question, so our whole mission is to make these sorts of products more and more accessible to people. So we’ve always just been quite grassroots about our ways that we give back. In Vancouver, for instance, there’s a lot of community fridges, so oftentimes we’ll go around and we’ll put product in these fridges or we’ll donate them to various shelters.

During COVID, we did a lot for Downtown Eastside shelters and then also to families in need, because we just want more people to be eating these products. Especially causes that have involvement with families and children. I do think that these sorts of products, especially Yoggu!. No refined sugars. It’s a probiotic. It’s dairy-free. They’re just so needed.

And then on the other side of that, there are a lot of really amazing vegan causes that we often donate things to for raffles or things like that. More recently, there was one, I think it’s on Vancouver Island, but it’s called Home for Hooves. They’re an animal sanctuary and they reached out and we’re really excited to be partnering with them I think this month or next month. It’s also really nice to connect with other vegan businesses because I really just want to uplift them and be supportive when we can.

JM: Well that’s what that question is all about. Like there’s no comparison and every little bit helps. Even sometimes businesses that are starting, maybe we talk to them and they’re just folding that into their business plan or whatever. So that’s amazing. Home for Hooves I think is going from 70 animals to 170, and they’re getting more property, and so there’s a lot going on, on the island for the vegan movement.

You mentioned it before, there’s not the seed capital yet, but maybe somebody watching this might have some other ideas.

What is a book, podcast, or app that you would recommend when it comes to entrepreneurship?

JH: Well my favorite book hands down, and I’ve reread it many times because it speaks to me differently every time, but Shoe Dog by Phil Knight. He’s the founder of Nike. More recently, when I read it, I feel like we’re in this really big explosive growth stage of the business and there’s been so many tests. The past three weeks have been a massive test for me, just grit, determination, all these sorts of things. And when I think about Shoe Dog, this book, it’s really just like…man, Phil Knight was thrown every curveball and he still managed to fight his way through and fight with this sort of integrity. And I really respect his journey.

I’ve sought out a lot of podcasts. For example, NPR has a great series called How I Built This with Guy Raz. I love that podcast, like anything, whether it’s your mental health, whether it’s just your journey in entrepreneurship, I think that when you feel less and less alone, it’s really helpful on those days when you’re just lacking that motivation. So when I’m feeling down, I’ll usually just go for a walk and listen to a How I Built This episode.

But also there was a phase where I was really interested in investment and funding. I was seeking out podcasts and seeing like, okay, do people talk about this? And truly the answer is no. A lot of people don’t talk about that sort of thing. I think it’s very specific to everybody’s entrepreneurial journey.

And it was like this question mark for me, so I really just sought out a lot of podcasts but didn’t quite get enough of the golden nuggets that I wanted. It ended up just being a lot more through conversations with various mentors and asking questions there.

I always have my eyes out for great podcasts. I’ve also been listening to Zach from The Juice Truck. They just started a podcast called A Little More Good. And it’s been amazing to hear more local stories. I love it. And I also just love that Zach and The Juice Truck and what they’re all about. So it’s really cool to listen to their podcast as well.

JM: Awesome awesome awesome recommendations. Speaking of other companies, maybe local, maybe global, maybe it is Nike, maybe it is Juice Truck, who knows:

What are some companies that you look up to, learn from and keep in touch with?

JH: I like that question. It’s a balance for me, right? I think that there’s staying focused on what your mission is and what your purpose is and staying on track.

There are so many brands. Locally, all of the amazing food options we have. We partner with a lot of amazing brands like MILA, Aleph, The Juice Truck. I love just supporting their businesses. I think that by sort of being in this local food scene, I have this massive appreciation for how much work it takes.

Recently I was at Save-On [Foods] and I saw Blue Heron Cheese and I had a moment where I was just like, wow, you know, I know how much work this takes to get to where they are right now. And to be able to support these companies. I’m so proud of so many amazing local startup success stories. And obviously, being in a store like Save-On, having that sort of accessibility as well, was really cool.

I think bigger brands…Patagonia has always been a company that I’ve really looked up to. I was reading a book of theirs called Let My People Go Surfing…it’s all about the philosophy behind the company and so much of that company culture. As I dive deeper into my business as that’s something that I just become more and more passionate about. Making sure that my staff have this incredible space to come to and feed their purpose as well, as humans and as individuals. Those are some companies that I look up to for sure.

JM: For sure. And what I’m hearing is creating a collective “why” and then empowering people to have their own “why” within or outside of that as well. So that’s fascinating.

Last question before we outro you and bid you adieu and let you get back to what you do best. So that last question is always prefaced by, this is not the time to be humble or modest.

Do you have any advice for entrepreneurs who may be at the beginning, middle, or even at an exit?

JH: So many. But you take these little gold nuggets every day. I think there’s so much learning and there’s so much dusting yourself off. I think for those entrepreneurs that are just getting started, my advice would be to just start. Don’t look for the perfect anything because realistically, if I’m being honest, nothing was perfect when I started. We were constantly evolving, and we still are constantly evolving.

I think that getting started is the hardest part. And so much of it is that internal voice and whether it’s confidence, anything inside of you that’s just like, “No, you shouldn’t start.” Just start.

And then when you’re sort of in the thick of it, for me it’s to trust my gut. We make probiotic yogurt, but constantly I’m like, man, I should have just trusted my gut. I’m feeding it all the good stuff. Why am I not listening to it? It’s become this daily practice for me to not only tune into that internal voice but also to action that as well. So even if I might feel it, I actually need to put that to practice. But sometimes it’s harder said than done. So that’s just been huge.

And I think there’s so much noise when you’re starting a company…everybody wants to be of service and everybody wants to give you their version of things. And I think sometimes, you always know what feels right. So it’s really just taking that time to really sit with that.

And then I think also it would be to have a balance. Like for me, I have a business coach and we talk a lot about this balance and peace in my life, because that’s what I’m always trying to cultivate. And sometimes entrepreneurship can be the exact opposite of that. But if I implement daily rituals and habits into my life, that sort of keeps everything a little bit more even. So I don’t think it’s selfish to take time for yourself.

I think that I’m always working, but if I can sort of slot those little moments into my life, it just makes me a better person and a better leader.

JM: Well, you heard it here, folks. Keep it simple, just act, just start and if that hasn’t already been a marketing campaign for you: “trust your gut,” now it is definitely.

So everybody, if you want to find out more, you can find out more about Yoggu! and Jade’s story on the web. That’s yoggu.ca. And more on Instagram @yoggu.foods. Thanks so much for joining us, Jade.

JH: Thank you so much, Justin. Okay, bye everyone!

 

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